I guess I didn't have to wait for a contribution to cause the fight to erupt. 

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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For a US profile, you would use a 'c', because that is the standard lower case form of 'C'.  For a French profile, however, the standard is a little different.  Whether or not you use 'c' or 'ç' depends on the name in question.

No, this is also true for every locality as long as the persons's name is French. Or are you saying that in the USA foreign names are not written correctly?

I wanted to touch on this one point...

Yes, for the average American, foreign names are not written correctly.  It is not intentional, it is simply based on the alphabet that we use.  Prior to this discussion, coming up in a different thread, had I come across a credit of 'FRANCOIS', I would have entered it as 'Francois'.  I did not take French in school, so I had no idea that 'C' could be anything other than 'c'.

We can not expect the average contributor to enter names based on languages they do not know.  Just like name parsing, there should be a default...local capitalization rules...with the option for correction if it was entered wrong.

This is why we should use caution when correction profiles in regions other than our own.

Quoting Unicus69:

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I guess I didn't have to wait for a contribution to cause the fight to erupt. 

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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For a US profile, you would use a 'c', because that is the standard lower case form of 'C'.  For a French profile, however, the standard is a little different.  Whether or not you use 'c' or 'ç' depends on the name in question.

No, this is also true for every locality as long as the persons's name is French. Or are you saying that in the USA foreign names are not written correctly?

I wanted to touch on this one point...

Yes, for the average American, foreign names are not written correctly.  It is not intentional, it is simply based on the alphabet that we use.  Prior to this discussion, coming up in a different thread, had I come across a credit of 'FRANCOIS', I would have entered it as 'Francois'.  I did not take French in school, so I had no idea that 'C' could be anything other than 'c'.

We can not expect the average contributor to enter names based on languages they do not know.  Just like name parsing, there should be a default...local capitalization rules...with the option for correction if it was entered wrong.

This is why we should use caution when correction profiles in regions other than our own.

That's not an issue specific to regions.
Truffaut stays Truffaut in R1, R2, R3, R4... and so on.  If the film credits show FRANCOIS TRUFFAUT, we must decide what the correct Credited Name is, regardless of the Region and regardless of the Locality where the DVD was sold. I don't want a Credited Name = Francois Truffaut in R1 and a Credited Name = François Truffaut in R2. That doesn't work, especially now that all the data are "linked" through common names and the Credited names have an effect on the results of the Credit Look-up tool.
Same goes for other names, like that of Cuban-born actor MARIO ERNESTO SANCHEZ. Must we enter that Credited Name as Mario Ernesto Sánchez, like Wikipedia suggests, or as Mario Ernesto Sanchez?
I think each choice has pros and cons, but I think a choice should be made.

A third option might be, perhaps, to enter the Credited Name as on screen, using conversion rules of its own language,  but enter the Common Name in a standardized form (when necessary), using only the 26 letters in the English alphabet.

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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Yes, for the average American, foreign names are not written correctly.  It is not intentional, it is simply based on the alphabet that we use.  Prior to this discussion, coming up in a different thread, had I come across a credit of 'FRANCOIS', I would have entered it as 'Francois'.  I did not take French in school, so I had no idea that 'C' could be anything other than 'c'.

It is ok if you convert "FRANCOIS" to "Francois" for a new name entry if you do not know about "François" in general or in this particular case.

But if you want to change "François" to "Francois" in an existing profile, you should better be convinced that you are right and be able to document it.

No argument there.

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Unicus69:

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We can not expect the average contributor to enter names based on languages they do not know.  Just like name parsing, there should be a default...local capitalization rules...with the option for correction if it was entered wrong.

We do not need any default.

Bad choice of words as we already have a default.  Whether we want to admit it or not, each of us enters the data, based on our own personal knowledge.

Quoting EnryWiki:

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That's not an issue specific to regions.
Truffaut stays Truffaut in R1, R2, R3, R4... and so on.  If the film credits show FRANCOIS TRUFFAUT, we must decide what the correct Credited Name is, regardless of the Region and regardless of the Locality where the DVD was sold. I don't want a Credited Name = Francois Truffaut in R1 and a Credited Name = François Truffaut in R2. That doesn't work, especially now that all the data are "linked" through common names and the Credited names have an effect on the results of the Credit Look-up tool.
Same goes for other names, like that of Cuban-born actor MARIO ERNESTO SANCHEZ. Must we enter that Credited Name as Mario Ernesto Sánchez, like Wikipedia suggests, or as Mario Ernesto Sanchez?
I think each choice has pros and cons, but I think a choice should be made.

A third option might be, perhaps, to enter the Credited Name as on screen, using conversion rules of its own language,  but enter the Common Name in a standardized form (when necessary), using only the 26 letters in the English alphabet.

I understand what you are saying, but how do you create a standard that everyone will be happy with?  Will our French users be happy with names entere using only the 26 letters in the English alphabet?  Our Spanish friends?  I don't know that answer, but these 'discussions' indicate, at least to me, that it won't be that simple. 

Quoting Behemot:

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? When exactly did I say I wanted to "dump" my cast lists to many profiles from a magnitude of localities? I'm talking about regular contributions of DVDs that I own, and that some of the stuff being claimed in this thread (and other similar threads lately) to be the "right" way of doing it is just way beyond what I'm willing to spend my time on. I've contributed many, many profiles the last years, both movies and TV series, and I'm perfectly willing to sit through the credits of both movies and entire TV series and enter the cast/crew members exactly the way they are credited. I am not, however, willing to check every single person with a potential double first name to see if they would prefer for it to be parsed all in the First Name field or in the First Name/Middle Name field; neither am I willing to spend time on checking every single capitalized French name found in the credits to see if it maybe should be written with an accent when not capitalized.

This you is not meant to be you personally but as this thread has shown there are people who want to do this (and are doing this already).

And it has been told to you by more than one person that you do not have to research each and every name on how it is parsed and translated to lower case. You only have to do the research if you want to change an existing entry.

Quoting RHo:

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Quoting Behemot:

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? When exactly did I say I wanted to "dump" my cast lists to many profiles from a magnitude of localities?

This you is not meant to be you personally but as this thread has shown there are people who want to do this (and are doing this already).

Actually only one person expressed such an intention and started doing that, but has now said he won't contribute any more, if I understand correctly what he wrote.

Quoting RHo:

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Yes, he is the only one who has began to contribute cast and crew to profiles he does not own. But others have agreed that this may be a favourable thing to do.

Yes. When there are profiles that are a verbatim copy from IMDb, or that credit Mozart for having composed the original score!, I think any correction from a substantially reliable source is welcome, even if it might be not "perfection", for a number of reasons we said.  While we discuss on some details (important details, I say, don't get me wrong, but still details), there are thousands of profiles out there that are complete garbage and just very few keen contributors working to correct them.

Quoting skipnet50:

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I do own the discs, James. I may not own the UPC/EAN but my hypothesis is that the data on the discs relative to cast and crew are the same. Are you now suggesting that differing disc ids, being a DIFFERENT disc makes a PROFILE uneditable. We now have to setup different profiles for EVERY disc ID to conform with your definition. LOL, James, that;s a road I don't think either one of us wants to go down.

Skip

If the DiscID is the same, then you own the disc, yes. Even if the UPC is different.

If the DiscID is different, then it is not the same disc that you own. It is simply the same film.